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 Fuel...regular or supreme

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theGerg



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PostSubject: Fuel...regular or supreme   Sat Jun 01, 2013 10:46 pm

So they exposed the fact that most cars/trucks these days don't require anything more than regular gas, and using premium can actually reduce your efficiency and increase your emissions, but what about the Rhino? Is it worth running premium? There is no extra cleaning/detergent in premium, it would all be about the octane count. What does everyone run, what would the experts recommend? I run an almost stock 700...just a sheave and a few other minor upgrades at this point.
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PostSubject: Re: Fuel...regular or supreme   Sat Jun 01, 2013 11:31 pm

That was discussed in one of the threads on here somewhere. I think the majority run regular unleaded. The octane difference is not worth the price on a stock machine. I run premium because the station I use has ethanol free premium unleaded. To me , that is worth the difference .

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PostSubject: Re: Fuel...regular or supreme   Sun Jun 02, 2013 12:32 am

Premium ethanol free here also.
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PostSubject: Re: Fuel...regular or supreme   Sun Jun 02, 2013 2:55 am

Im lucky enough to have multiple stations with E0 87 around me so that is what I run. I used to run E0 91 in my 700 Grizzly but it backfired alot and ran better on 87.

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PostSubject: Re: Fuel...regular or supreme   Sun Jun 02, 2013 12:39 pm

The low octane gas makes my 660 backfire. I notice a huge difference with the 91. It's the difference of backfiring every time I let off the pedal or not backfiring at all.
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123.bert0621

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PostSubject: Re: Fuel...regular or supreme   Sun Jun 02, 2013 7:27 pm

I run 4 degrees advanced timing so premium is what I use.

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PostSubject: Re: Fuel...regular or supreme   Sun Jun 02, 2013 8:05 pm

Doesnt the dynatek cdi advance the timing 4 degrees.

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08Rhino450SE

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PostSubject: Re: Fuel...regular or supreme   Sun Jun 02, 2013 10:06 pm

i use premium because it contains more detergents. depending on where you live, it might not contain ethanol. in ohio they don't check for ethanol content, so without testing we honestly don't know. i don't know about "reduced efficiency." i'd like to see dyno charts...

i don't always run the entire tank out each week, so the extra volatility and lack of ethanol keeps longer in the tank. it's worth it to me to have the peace of mind that i haven't had any fuel problems for 40 years. to each his own, i suppose, it's kinda like a ford vs. chevy thing imo. i gave up worrying about what the so-called experts say, and do what i think works for me. bounce

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PostSubject: Re: Fuel...regular or supreme   Sun Jun 02, 2013 10:15 pm

My rhino back fires some time when I let of the gas I have after market CDI and I use 87 octane. Do you think the back firing will harm my engine. Should I use a 91 or 89 octane.

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PostSubject: Re: Fuel...regular or supreme   Sun Jun 02, 2013 10:18 pm

don't think it's an octane thing. probably lean fuel mixture. is it carb'd?
sometimes something as simple as raising the idle will cure a lift throttle backfire.

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PostSubject: Re: Fuel...regular or supreme   Sun Jun 02, 2013 10:25 pm

So i should just increase the idle. Thanks

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PostSubject: Re: Fuel...regular or supreme   Sun Jun 02, 2013 10:29 pm

I pulled this off of Grizzlycentral, he is talking about ethanol and octane both. I was having lots of backfiring issues on my 2012 Grizzly 700 and after I read this I went back to 87 and there were no more issues. It makes sense if it is burning slowing in low compression engines it is still firing when it's leaving the exhaust. This is a non issue in my Rhino now which did backfire a little it wasn't warmed all the way off and I would come off the throttle to coast because I am going to 11:1 piston this week so it's 91 or 93 from here on out for me.


Quote:
Originally Posted by 07grizzlymud View Post
Actually ethanol produces more power, but you will burn more.
Completely false! Fuel is rated in BTU/GAL.
Regular US gasoline 87 octane 114,100 BTU/GAL
100% Ethanol 76,100 BTU/GAL
Regular gas w/10% etahnol 111,836 BTU/GAL

You guy's need to read and learn what octane ratings really are. The self ignition temp of fuel. Premium is NOT cleaner burning, more like premium price. Some brands do burn cleaner due to the additives they add. All brand trucks fill up at the same refinery, same loading station, same hoses, and the brand specific additive is added at that time. Racetrack and other "discount" gas stations sell straight gasoline, no additives. That is why they can sell it cheaper and it does burn "dirtier" than say shell or chevron. A stock bike only requires regular 87 octane gas. Anything higher than that is wasting money and running your engine hotter. Ethanol is only added as a government subsidy to support the corn farmers. If your tax money did not subsidize it, they couldn't afford to produce and sell it. Talk about being fleeced. Not only do you pay for them to make it and sell it back to you, it cost millions in repair bills each year. That crap is completely useless. Everyone who owns a gasoline engine needs to research this stuff. If every one really understood the ethanol fiasco, they would be beating down the doors of their congressmans/womans door.

EDIT: premium gas is for higher compression engines. If you have a high compression setup then by all means use the proper fuel rating. Wanna see your exhaust glow cherry red....run premium (slower burning fuel) in a stock bike. The fuel is still burning as it exits the exhaust valve and enters the exhaust. Running premium in a combustion engine designed for 87 will cause it to lose power, a dyno will quickly prove that but for the geeks, search the otto-cycle.

End of ethanol rant....for now.

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PostSubject: Re: Fuel...regular or supreme   Sun Jun 02, 2013 10:32 pm

ford

http://www.fuel-testers.com/ethanol_engine_precautions.html

ethanol is added to increase the octane of the regular fuel. it is also hydroscopic. you run what you want to run. bounce

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PostSubject: Re: Fuel...regular or supreme   Mon Jun 03, 2013 12:29 am

I run an MSD fuel controller it has alot of preloaded settings and you can also change them on your computer,premium fuel resists detonation and pre-ignition in higher compression engines by preventing two flame fronts moving across your piston one from ignition and one caused by hot engine parts this allows the flame front to move across the piston pushing down more evenly producing more power.I know my Rhino has at 10:1 compression this means it is a high preformance engine requiring more octane. If your machines is the exhaust turning red then maybe you have fuel burning there.Yamaha has recommened that you run 91 octane no higher than 10 percent alcahol since 2005 atleast. You can run 87 octane in the modern vehicles because there PCM can adjust,but if you pay for 680 hp and run 87 octane you will never see it unless you use the premium fuel. the RHINO is not OBD ll, and can only run what was loaded in the PCM at the factory,91 octane to produce max power.It is what it is! (premium fuel is more expensive because it takes longer to make,boil it)

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Last edited by 123.bert0621 on Mon Jun 03, 2013 12:32 am; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : more)
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thekevin

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PostSubject: Re: Fuel...regular or supreme   Mon Jun 03, 2013 12:55 am

I just looked at the 2013 700 manual and it says 86 octane or 91 "research octane number", there is a difference in the ratings. If you look on the pumps you will see the (R+M)/2) formula which is the Research Octane number and Motor Octane Number added together and divided by 2 to get the average which is what is shown on the pumps. 86 octane shown on our pumps is 91 RON. If I was running a 10:1 motor I personally wouldn't run 86 octane but these motors are only 9.2:1 from the factory. Like I said earlier mine is now 11:1 and I will only run 91 E0 fuel in mine from here on.

They shouldn't make this so hard and the people that make the cars and atv's should tell you exactly what to run to make them run the best. I noticed on my wife's 2013 Ford Edge that where you fill it up it has a graphic for E20 with a big red X over it. I'm sure that most people would never see that wouldn't know not to run 20% ethanol fuel in it.

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JE 11:1 102mm
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Stock Raptor cam - Stock exhaust w/ 2.5" turndown
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JBS Sheave w/ 15gr od's, kms wet clutch weights, gold spring
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Snorider



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PostSubject: Re: Fuel...regular or supreme   Mon Jun 03, 2013 2:07 am

I run both in mine. ethanol free premium in the spring and fall and regular with marine additive in the summer. haven't really noticed a difference switching from either in my rhino. but run the ethanol free in mine coming into and out of winter. Since I ONLY run ethanol free in my sleds thats when I start keeping it around and make sure it goes into the rhino as well. I do NOT like having ethanol gas in something that is going to sit much. its nasty what it does to stuff. especially on carb'd vehicles. makes the float bowls green and will cement the needle in the position the floats kept it. I have had it seized shut against the seat and open before. both took pliers to remove both of them for cleaning.

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PostSubject: Re: Fuel...regular or supreme   Mon Jun 03, 2013 9:49 am

if i run 87 in mine i backfires like crazy if i run premium thats ethanol free it tuns great.

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PostSubject: Re: Fuel...regular or supreme   Mon Jun 03, 2013 9:51 am

I don't pretend to understand fuel grading blah, blah blah, or have any interest in researching it but I can tell you with 100% certainty that when I run 87 my Rhino backfires and it backfires a TON. When I run 91 it doesn't backfire at all...none, zero.

I've even run half a day on 91 and filled up at a station that only had one pump/one grade...87. The rest of the day the guys behind me felt like they were at the shooting range.
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